Whistler Allen's big step with Small Yard
Interview by Mackenzie Wagner
Small Yard was a long time coming for Whistler Allen. It’s a look inside Allen's mind as he shares his experiences and struggles in his songs. Following the release, Ease Up writer Mackenzie Wagner was able to talk with Allen about creating solo music for the first time, preparing for a tour again, and the importance of mental health.
Ease Up: Congrats on the release, it's amazing! How are you doing? How are you feeling?
Whistler Allen: In general, or about the release?
EU: Both!
Whistler: Good! I think the release has been good, in general, just kind of soaking up the final months of time off before we disappear for a while and get back on the road. But yeah, I think overall I’m doing pretty well.
EU: Good! I know you mentioned going on the road soon. It’s been quite a while, are you excited? Nervous?
Whistler: Both. Yeah, lots of things. I’m definitely excited, I’m a pretty big homebody so I enjoy my time at home, but it has been a long time since we’ve really been out there doing the usual month to two month stretches. I think I’m really looking forward to playing new stuff and having a new show, and spending time with the crew and friends, and whatnot again, it will be good. I’m definitely nervous. Not really for Hippo and making sure things go well, I really always believe in that and trust in that. But I definitely had battled with some performance anxiety over the last year and a half of our touring cycle, mostly through 2019 so I think the last couple of years have been like a nice break. But you know, just slowly preparing myself for being back on the road and working on how to properly manage and handle all that stuff. So that’s really the only thing I’m nervous about but it’s also something that, I’m going to be okay and it will be fun. Anyways…
EU: Yeah absolutely. Every time you guys perform it’s great so I’m sure it will be another great tour! So, you just released Small Yard. What song were you most excited for people to hear?
Whistler: Hm. I think "Coming Home" is a very important song and the most relevant to me these days. It’s one of the more recently written tunes since starting all of these. It talks a lot pretty bluntly about what I just kind of talked about with the anxiety and stuff. I think in terms of like a message and people can kind of get a little taste of who I am, I think that’s a very important song and what I was excited for people to hear. But also sonically, it’s very much who I am and it is the closest to how like- the production ended up in a space that is very similar to how I tend to write songs which is kind of just like with a guitar and my voice. And similar to like "New Boy" a little bit where it's pretty much just straight up like me playing piano and singing. I think "Coming Home" is good. I don’t know, it’s tough, they’re all important tunes in terms of getting to know me as a human being.
EU: Yeah, definitely. I think Small Yard as a whole tells a lot about you. It gives listeners a very good idea of who you are in a way that maybe they would not have known before. As we’ve been saying, it’s a personal project. Were there any songs that you were nervous to release?
Whistler: Um, not necessarily. I think the thing I was most nervous to put out there was the music video for "Baseball Cap". Mostly just because I’m a pretty reserved dude and dancing is not something I ever do and so you know it took basically up until the day I released it or like a couple days prior for me to like even start believing in myself in that space when it comes to the video. And like, I don’t think I even showed anyone the video and I’ve had it for quite some time. I didn’t even show roommates or band members I was just like so embarrassed by it. I say I’m embarrassed by it, but it’s not an embarrassing piece of work. I think it is unique and cool and a piece of who I am for sure. I think I just tell myself that I’m embarrassed by it because I’m insecure as hell, so.
EU: But it’s amazing! It’s always nerve-wracking to do something different but it’s great! How does it feel to share your personal experiences in this capacity?
Whistler: Feels great. It is nice to get this out there. A lot of the songs are old and have to do with old thoughts and times in my life that I’ve been kind of waiting forever to let people know about. And if you get me in a space where I’m comfortable and feeling talkative I’ll definitely have no issue talking about this kind of stuff. I can get pretty personal pretty quick but most of the time like I said earlier I’m pretty reserved and I don’t interact with people, and I’m pretty introverted. So, it’s been great to be able to release these. Yeah, I don’t know I don’t feel any real way I guess about being personal and sharing personal experiences with people, other than I’m always kind of here for it. I think last note on that would be with a song like "Coming Home" or any of these being like some traumatic experiences in my life and stuff it’s good to release it and have it in the world and I don’t know it’s like sewing a badge or a patch on your jacket and wearing that every day and being like- this is who I am. And I’m proud of that and I want everybody to understand that’s who I am and this is what I struggle with and that’s what I’ve dealt with in the past and it’s made me the person I am today.
EU: Well, that kind of goes into my next question- what has been the most rewarding part of this all? Would you say that getting to share your story has been rewarding for you?
Whistler: Yeah, I think that’s a rewarding aspect of it for sure. I mean, just to- first of all I have a huge privilege to be able to share these stories and have people actually listen to them, you know. There’s lots of people out there that write probably better- not probably better, definitely write better songs than me and make better music that don’t have the privilege of a fanbase waiting to listen. So that’s an amazing thing in its own, but I would say just to be able to do this for myself. In the ways that I’m reserved socially I reserve myself as well as an artist and kind of hold myself back a lot so it was a good challenge for me to like show up and have to finish this. I’m not great at finishing things or believing that they’re finished so I just like, I think it was really cool it felt really good for me to be able to finish this and get it out there and now I’m done with it and I don’t really have to think about it too much anymore. That was probably the most rewarding for me.
EU: At what point did you say “this is done”?
Whistler: It was some time this summer, it was when the mixes and the masters were set. I guess before that, still some time this summer. Yeah, it felt good to feel like the music was finished because it’s been a long time coming, so.
EU: So, you’ve been working on it for quite a while… How has isolation and just everything going on the past two years impacted your music? Has it changed Small Yard in any way?
Whistler: It definitely had an affect on the project. You’d think that having a bunch of time on your hands would make you write a lot more, but… Well for some people that’s what happens. I’m just not somebody who writes a lot for whatever reason. The ways in which the pandemic and all this isolation aided to it was just the fact that after a full year of… We basically kind of stopped the hard work for Hippo’s LP3 in springtime of 2020. It took about a year for me to get to a point of being like “I think I can do this and I can hold this together and make this project, and have a whole other year until we do anything”. It took until the spring of ’21 for me to learn how to be home again and be busy while being home because I hadn’t been home for longer than two months, maybe three months in six years and even to get three months at home was maybe once or twice. Yeah, it took a while but it definitely aided. All the isolation definitely aided in me being able to wake up and get myself to do something that day. It gave me something to do which is great, it helped fill my time and helped cure some of the loneliness and stuff. Yeah, I don’t know, it took a while but also during COVID and all that stuff I wrote a lot of other songs that led me to- Well, through COVID I wrote other songs whether they were for Hippo during that process or after that during the summer of 2020 and winter and fall I wrote a handful of other songs and produced them out and got them to some cool spots but it just… I was thinking of this big album that I wanted to release but I was like, none of this really feels cohesive, all this new stuff feels very new in comparison to Small Yard and maybe Little Man and even Coming Home kind of fits in with this new stuff but it was still of a different time. So, I guess that was one way that it affected me, I just had to think of what fit together and what felt right. Sorry, I’m rambling…
EU: No! Do you think you’d want to release those other songs that you wrote… is there another project?
Whistler: Um, that’s the big question [laughs]. Small Yard was definitely a way to release some old stuff that I had built up and have been wanting to release for a while without any major thought, I guess. And so, it was also a way for me to get my feet on the ground as a solo artist like getting my YouTube page, just to get some sort of following so in the future I don’t have to start so fresh, you know? So yes, my goal is to be able to release something again. Who knows when? But even then, it may not be just a project, I kind of have a desire to just like drop a song here and there just for the heck of it. I’m trying to gain anything out of this solo project really other than allowing people to hear what I like to make, mostly because I don’t end up really having many of my own songs get through to the final stages within Hippo. So it’s been a space for me, like a second-hand store, like a thrift store of music for me where I can kind of go donate these tunes to a space where I know they’ll be appreciated because they didn’t get to see the light of day or something. Yeah, there will be more from me. In what capacity? I have no clue.
EU: Nice! So, with this project, you were really able to tell a story. How was writing music and telling a story yourself different from doing it in a band setting?
Whistler: Very different because this EP is all just about me. I don’t really have any words in the Hippo world in terms of lyrics. So that’s kind of how it’s different. I don’t really write stories for Hippo, or at least I haven’t really had that opportunity. Or, I’ve had the opportunity but I haven’t had that moment come to fruition. I’ve had a couple like once or twice but nothing too serious and intense. Also, I think with Hippo we’re learning how to allow for that kind of space and allow for you know, my stuff is so personal and raw lyric wise. Pretty straightforward and simple where Hippo tends to- well it’s not me writing it so it tends to not be that at all and it tends to be more cryptic. I don’t know, you know you’ve probably listened to the songs of Hippo’s and it’s still tangible things and ideas but at the same time like what are they talking about? I don’t even know half of the time! I just kind of show up and help craft the sound, and obviously drums, but also, I’m just part of the production more so than I am the storytelling. But I would love to be more a part of that and that’s what we’re looking towards. But that’s where the difference is. The biggest difference is I’m a part of one and not a part of the other so much. Yeah, I think my writing style is lyrically very different from the other guys or at least from the usual Hippo lyricists.
EU: Yeah! Well, your lyrics definitely tell a story and by listening straight through listeners get to hear about you in a way that by listening to other projects you don’t necessarily hear, which was really cool! Speaking of…
Whistler: Sorry I’m going to stop your question for a second! What did you feel you heard?
EU: I feel like I heard like… reading your mind and getting to hear your experiences. Things that aren’t necessarily talked about and I feel like listeners got to hear about you and your life and I think that was really nice to hear. And it was done beautifully.
Whistler: Thank you! You can continue, sorry.
EU: Speaking of Hippo Campus, you guys are going on tour soon, how do the new places you see, and experiences and people… How has all that impacted your music?
Whistler: That’s a good question… You know, I don’t know really. I guess the only song that has been written about tour is Coming Home. But I guess in some ways it’s not necessarily directly the places I go and the people I meet that affect my music. It's more of the process of being on the road for weeks on end. I don’t write too much about tour and I don’t know how much it really impacts me… my music. I know how much it impacts me as a person.
EU: Do you want to talk about that a little bit?
Whistler: Yeah. Like I was talking earlier, I think… this is going to get serious. I think mental health in the music world is something that isn’t very… at least in my experience hasn’t been very present. I’ve met only one band that is younger that actually has a different mindset about it all. Also, every person that tours will always have a different experience. Some people are totally unaffected by everything. But I just tend to be a very introspective human and I can get stuck in my head pretty easily. Waking up every day in a different place and living in a bus and a venue is a privilege but it also is a way to live a life. It’s about finding, for me, it’s about finding the best way to adapt my actual home life to tour. Which is really difficult. It feels near impossible at times because there’s a lot of things at home like my girlfriend or my cat or being able to go play hockey or exercise, or just have time, or honestly the biggest one just having a moment alone in your room where for somebody like me I’m seeing 12 people every single day no matter what for up to two to three months and that’s a lot. I love them to death but also, I don’t love people that much, you know? I don’t thrive with that much interaction; I don’t think any of us really do. I just tend to struggle with it a bit more and I feel like more people tend to struggle with it than they let on. But, that’s okay, it’s just about their journey and where they’re at and how comfortable they are when it comes to talking about it, but I’ve had amazing conversations and great moments with certain artists while on the road or when they come to Minneapolis. Any time I can really connect with another artist and share my life experience and story, it’s rare that I express what I am expressing now and they don’t get it or that they don’t also agree. It’s weird, it’s just one of those things where we live an insanely privileged lifestyle and this is kind of what New Boy talks about but I couldn’t help for a long time but feel like I didn’t deserve it or I feel like any time I had some sort of “Shit this is exhausting I don’t really want to be here today, I don’t want to wake up on this bus” and I feel panicky or anxiety about going into the venue or feeling like I don’t have anywhere to go besides the venue or the bus, that’s a feeling that sucks. It sucks because it’s anxiety and anxiety is scary but it also sucks because you don’t want to feel that. You’re doing the thing you love most and you’re still feeling overwhelmed by it sometimes. That realization also makes me more anxious because it’s like… I’m not supposed to feel like this, I’m living the life that people spend their entire life trying to live and I got it at 20. It’s been 7 years and it’s been amazing, I’m very fortunate and very happy, I wouldn’t trade it for the world, but I also can’t help but feel overwhelmed and anxious sometimes about the fact that I have to maintain this lifestyle to be able to do what I love most which is perform. I’m like nobody compared to the real people in the world who have to deal with fame and success, it’s insane. I don’t know if I wish it upon anybody but if they want it they should go get it.
EU: Yeah, mental health, especially in the music industry it’s an important topic and an important conversation to have so I’m very glad that we can have this conversation and you’re willing to share all of this. I do have one more question, is there anything you want to share about Small Yard that we haven’t talked about or anything you want to say to listeners?
Whistler: I feel like I’ve covered the EP relatively well, I think. I think at the same time for both the EP and just listeners like what you were just saying, outside the music industry as well it’s a really important think to be cognitive of and I really hope that listeners, fans, or people who are just curious or maybe struggling can hear my music and know- or even hear this interview or read somewhere that I’m also struggling and so it’s not like… it’s cliché it feels, it’s an experience that makes you feel alone really easily. In my line of work but also just struggling with anxiety and mental health and it literally is one of the most common things I’ve found in human beings is that they have some sort of mental health struggles to varying degrees. But I think our society unfortunately really just shits on the idea of taking care of yourself or even just thinking about yourself and wanting to better yourself. And I think that’s a bummer, especially for young kids because I didn’t have anxiety until I was maybe 21 and I know lots of kids have it at much younger ages. So I really hope that however people find their way to better their mental health I hope they can at least start the journey of practicing what they need to practice. I’ve been in therapy for 10 years and that’s been a way for me, it’s been amazing and very helpful and I also know that talk therapy isn’t for everybody. But, if you have parents who happen to struggle to agree or understand or don’t know how to support, that doesn’t mean that there aren’t people who do know how to support and it’s okay to talk to people and tell them that you’re feeling confused, overwhelmed, or anxious. Most of the time, in my experiences, when I don’t do that, it gets worse and when I do go and talk to somebody and just say like, “I feel kind of crazy and I’m overwhelmed and anxious and stressed'', it doesn’t cure it necessarily but it tames it and helps me feel less alone, helps me feel a little less overwhelmed I guess. So I hope that I can help empower people to go talk about it with somebody like a friend or a parent or an aunt or uncle, I don’t know. I just hope people take care of themselves.
EU: That’s a really great message. Conversations like this and your music… you express that so well. Thank you for being so open, congrats again on the release!